Special Attack 3 is too Weak?

Shadowind_Prime13

I have seen some bots with their Special 3 are weaker than their Special 2. Some examples:
Winblade
Prowl
Barricade
Ironhide
Soundwave
Shockwave
Mirage
Rhinox
Bumblebee
Bonecrusher

Shadowind_Prime13

Also Optimus MV1 and Grimlock (a little bit)
And why this is can happen? Special 3 supposedly stronger than the Special 2...

Slibby8803

Shadowind_Prime13 wrote: »

Also Optimus MV1 and Grimlock (a little bit)
And why this is can happen? Special 3 supposedly stronger than the Special 2...

How many times have you missed with a sp3? I am guessing never. Sp1 and sp2 take timing and skill to avoid them being dodged or blocked.

MaxBebop

The sp3s have more to them than just pure damage, the after effects they leave can give you an advantage in the fight, both prowl and Soundwave lock the enemies power gain, Soundwave can also leave your opponent stunned, bee leaves behind a strong shock which btw melts mv1's HP if his sig is active. From that list I would say both wind and bone need improvement.

JatinderSingh

I suppose that Since its an unblockable it has set some limits.
And Yes there are weak with somebots

Hired_Goon

Some of these I agree with, some I dont. As Slibby8803 stated, SP3's cant miss. MaxBebop also listed a great bit with some of the SP3s having added effects that make up for the lack of damage.

Ironhide has a more powerful S3 hands down. Only way a S2 will do more damage is if Obliteration pops and you manage a crit on every hit. And most of your damage is still done on final hit. My 4* (w/ Obliteration) has popped close to 3k on final hit of S2 and over 5k on the S3 hit.

Barricade gets a huge crit modifier that lasts a good chunk of time with his S3.

Soundwave and Prowl have the added benefits of Power Lock

Shockwave S3 can be very powerful with the Shock stacks if you have been building charges

Mirage S3 hits like a truck if you have him duped AND adds a buff that gives permanent attack buffs just for dodging attacks that will buff all future attacks during fight duped or not

Rhinox S3 hits like a truck if you can proc 8+ bleed stacks(not uncommon)

Bumblebees S3 is aimed at taking out an opponent with armor stacks

Bonecrusher has some great bleed with his S3 and that's always a good thing

Windblade is honestly the only character on the list I really agree with. Her S3 has always been just lackluster despite it being one of my favorite S3 animations.

Mustangjon

S2 can crit extremely hard as a whole is where the s3 doesn't is main reason it excels mcoc was same way I agree that s3 should be most powerful but also as some stated the s3 leaves buffs and lasting effects that make some more worthy to use but as a whole I use very few

Synthwave

Yeah, the only one I really agree with is Windblade. She needs some kind of debuff or buff to trigger afterwards.

You really do not want her to get to sp3. A huge waste of power gain that would've been better spent on her greens and maybe yellow.

Most scouts though are designed to use only their sp1's.

Blazinhobbs

Ironhide sp3 is one thats very devastating

Manthro

Windblade had a better s3 when it had a near guaranteed chance to stun. The percentage got nerfed and it almost never triggers.

Her S2 more than makes up for it though. The only time I use her s3 is when I accidentally overcharge the bar, lol

Drake6401

Most of these I agree with, but not Ironhide. It's a gamble, but his S3 can be a near instant kill if the ability triggers with the crit buff active. Prowl actually has a really good one too, because of that long power lock and getting energy with him is really quick and easy once you get his ability.

The unavoidable part is a factor in their damage. Personally, I'd much rather them require a successful hit to activate if it meant more damage. Combo linking specials is extremely easy.

I feel like S3 attacks exist to make beating enemies way over your level impossible. It's the one thing you can't avoid and some characters will cling to their energy for their lives until they hit that final mark.

I don't commonly use a few of the listed characters, but from my experience, Shockwave, Soundwave, Rhinox and Windblade have it the worst right now. Shockwave can at least build 3 to 7 more charges (With 4* Rhinox) but since most of the damage is done after the attack phase, enemies normally just use their S3 right after and save themselves, which is annoying. That is being said with the understanding that Shockwave only gets good at a really high rank though.

Shadowind_Prime13

Just count the damage on Special 3 plus count the cost to get one Power Bar ( Between Special 2 and 3 ), then you will see that all of the bot on my list above is true ( Except for Ironhide, I don't know why I listed him, and Hot Rod is on the list too).

Shadowind_Prime13

Just make a combo then unleash Special 2 so the opponent can't miss (except for Evade), It's easier to use than the Special 3, faster to get and dealt more damage (for the bots on my list)

Shadowind_Prime13

So then any update? To make the Special 3 more balanced?

KillMasterC

Why? You should start to listen when so many ppl prefer S3 to stay where they are. S3 aren't unbalanced, it's very balanced with S2. Most of us agree that S2 does more damage and stick to S2 combo. If S3 get a huge increase in damage, you will be frustrated with enemies holding S3, especially Grindor/Motormaster who are so common in base defense. Special baiting is already hard after 2.0, if S3 got stronger we're doomed against tougher bots.

Bonecrusher's S3 is dramatically boosted after eating the opponent's special first.

If there's something to complain, that's should be Arcee and Bludgeon's pathetic S2.

Shadowind_Prime13

Don't be pessimistic, at what point you don't want the bots on my list's Special 3 have increased damage? Did you notice that I made request to increase Special 3 damage FOR the bots on my list? And not for the bots out of my list?

KillMasterC

If I'm not wrong, you're requesting 10 bots, if not 9, to have their S3 boosted, when the roster of the game is about 24. That's a huge modification in terms of balance. Not to mention that many bots in your list are already top tier (Prowl, Soundwave, Shockwave). Imagine how hard it will be to Raid a base full of Robot Resource and the aforementioned bots.

If S3 deals more damage than S2, they should be blockable.

Manthro

Shadowind_Prime13 wrote: »

So then any update? To make the Special 3 more balanced?

Why? Because you want to have a WIN button?

I think you're missing the big picture... You make S3 more powerful on all these bots, that means it is more powerful in every game mode for the AI as well.

Think about what you're asking.

Shadowind_Prime13

That's what I do. I'm OK if the enemy got increased Special 3 damage as well as I do

tekkn1kal

Guys, look at it this way... if SP3 was even stronger, consider what it would be like when you fail to bait SP3 and what the AI which is generally stronger than you would hit for.

The reality to me is, I rarely ever use SP3. I see it as something that is there for the AI to have that we cannot dodge, so we can't just unload on them. It is a protection mechanism that forces us to fight patiently, and adds another layer of difficulty to the fights.

lilbeastie

I don't have a problem with the power of any of the sp3 (except maybe Windblade).

However I do think it's stupid that some sp3 are entirely unblockable whereas others are not - Sonic Shield or Evade Ranged for example shouldn't come into play, especially at some point after activation that you can do nothing about. The point of an sp3 (and the reason many are no more powerful than the boy's sp2) is that it can't be blocked so it should hit fully each time.

Manthro

None of the abilities you listed come into play against L3 attacks. The only part of sonic shield that would affect L3 is the damage reduction, but not the reflect.

And evade doesn't work against L3 at all

KillMasterC

How can you expect Sideswipe to evade when falling from the sky after Grindor throw him (Man I'm good)? Or to evade when Grimlock is biting (Man I'm good)? Or to evade when Motormaster try to head smash him (Oops, Man I'm good!)? Would laugh my ass off to imagine those animations.

Shadowind_Prime13

KillMasterC wrote: »

How can you expect Sideswipe to evade when falling from the sky after Grindor throw him (Man I'm good)? Or to evade when Grimlock is biting (Man I'm good)? Or to evade when Motormaster try to head smash him (Oops, Man I'm good!)? Would laugh my ass off to imagine those animations.

If it's true, try this. Barricade after hit by heavy attack from Windblade got full evade. Imagine when Windblade use her Special 3 then Barricade evading like crazy

Shadowind_Prime13

So...if it's not increased damage, it's okay to add some buffs or debuffs.
Maybe for Windblade Special 3 can inflict Stormfall Blast for 8 seconds
And for Soundwave Special 3 can give him Unblockable Attacks for 5 seconds?

lilbeastie

Manthro wrote: »

None of the abilities you listed come into play against L3 attacks. The only part of sonic shield that would affect L3 is the damage reduction, but not the reflect.

And evade doesn't work against L3 at all

Sorry but that's just not true- sonic shield affects (and reflects) WB and Barricade SP3. Whether it's supposed to or not is another matter, but I've seen it happen and so have others in my alliance.

Arcee can also auto-evade parts of an IH SP2, which makes no sense either. Once the first shot lands all the others should hit too regardless of abilities, since it's logical those abilities shouldn't be in effect directly following a rocket to the face.

Shadowind_Prime13

That made Soundwave really poor, if charged to Special 3, the attacks are way too low than the Special 2 so players shoulda avoid charging up to Special 3. So moderators? Please fix it

Frugalli88

Shadowind_Prime13 wrote: »

That made Soundwave really poor, if charged to Special 3, the attacks are way too low than the Special 2 so players shoulda avoid charging up to Special 3. So moderators? Please fix it

3 should be weaker than 2 since it’s a guarantee hit

Mustangjon

Don’t forget special effects most l3 have

Nick_80

Ironhide is already the one touch god. I can’t imagine his sp3 getting a buff.



God help us all.

Totherkins

I support the sp3 buff. And any buffs to Ironhide.