Forge data from the 411

The TFTF 411 Bot has observations about forging. These are player observations only and not "official stats", so if you notice some different results, please don't take it out on Kabam - it's more likely my fault (and I have no connection with Kabam beyond being a loudmouthed player/customer). These are all available through the 411 bot in Line, but I want to share them here as well so players can more easily give feedback

Huge thanks to @KingOfPain and @Sabugen for all their help with this

There is also a trial "forge calculator" that should tell you how much forge XP to expect and what forge level you should reach when forging a particular bot, as well as how many bot crystal shards you'll get
It doesn't tell you how much ore and gold to expect, yet
If more than one person uses it at once, it'll get messy, but you can save a copy to your own Google Sheets folder if you want to spend a lot of time on it
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gbt1eKvjFlrAyoOVRDTSMlx519G1pVR2f8qxv1TjzHk/edit?usp=sharing

You get bonus forge XP when you unlock level 75-100 (ie the first time you use the same bot from one tier below) but we haven't been able to confirm how much that's worth yet because we only just discovered that it happens. Unlocking 75-100 in a 4* bot seems to be worth about 550 forge XP, but that's from just one observation

Forge XP:
qlgrkxrxgm66.png

Gold cost to rank bots:
s8jnq2se46dp.png

Gold cost per forge point:
m8qv2cy7b41s.png

This data is for sig.0 bots. If you're forging awakened or forged bots, you'll use less gold per forge point, but that becomes difficult to put succinctly in a table

Bot crystal shards:
uwqzvalmyavr.png

If you want to translate it into other languages, send me a PM. We've already got a Chinese language version that I shared on WeChat, but will post here too later

Final point - these are subject to change, but we're confident that this is a pretty accurate reflection of how forging works currently, accepting some degree of uncertainty when consuming 3* rank 4 bots, especially if they have high forge and sig levels or have same class or bot synergies - these very high end forges seem to have some inconsistency that's difficult to explain

Hope people find this useful!

Comments

  • KillMasterCKillMasterC Posts: 948
    edited November 2017
    Congratulations for the hard work Trailfire and the 411 Team!
    Quick question (that has always been around) before I dig into the sheets and the calculator: is the resource to exp ratio fix, or variant or monotonous increasing? People keep asking if there's a turning point or something to be careful of. If there isn't, they can blindly eat a raw rot in shortage of no gold/ore, and max it when there is plenty of resources.
  • What I learn from "Gold cost per forge point":
    1. It's in general unnecessary to rank up the fodder at all, as all 2/3/4 star bots are best forged at 1/10.
    2. 3 star is better than 1 star than 2 star.

    Correct?
  • Thanks KMC!
    Responding to your last question first: Yes and no.

    I'd say if you really have a gold shortage, but plenty of bots, then yeah, you'll get more forge points per unit of gold spent if you just forge a rank1 level 10 bot. But you wont get *many* forge points. Certainly you'll get relatively low forge points per bot consumed! You'll have maximum gold efficiency if you use 1/1 bots, since they don't need any gold at all. But you'll have maximum bot efficiency if you use 3* 4/40 sig0 bots

    I say sig0 assuming every 5 sig levels is an extra bot that could've been a 4/40 bot. Each 5 sig levels are worth 1,100, whereas you get 9,000 for a 4/40 bot. Of course you'll never have enough ore and gold to rank every 3* to 4/40 before it dupes, so ultimately you just need to balance your resources based on how much you have of each type on hand

    Your first question about the resource:XP ratio, it's not fixed. That's what the Gold cost per forge point is about. The resources to create a rank1 bot are low, and so you get a high efficiency, but just a small final number.

    Essentially, resource efficiency goes down as the forge value of the bot goes up. If you don't have many t1alpha sparks expiring, I wouldn't recommend forging rank4 bots. If you have more t1a than you can use, then I'd only ever forge rank4 bots. If you're thinking about selling spare t1a, this might be something you consider - is your AM team already forge100? If not, you might use the t1a to take some 3* bots r4 before forging them. If yes, then 3* r4 are basically meaningless - sell the t1a for t2a essence! :)

    Sorry it's not a clear answer, but it really depends on the resources available to you at the time, which is depends on the stage of the game you're at


    (btw, gold use is closely tied to ore use, since basic ore uses 1.05 gold/ore and class ore uses 0.9 gold/ore - ranking also uses gold, of course)

  • Yeah I was too quick to jump to that conclusion. When thinking it over, it's a game of balancing of what I have and what I want. I don't have infinite 3* bots to start with. They're rare. They farm gold/ore/exp on base or in story, they gain Arena points and thus all kinds of rewards including gold.
  • TrailfireTrailfire Posts: 590
    edited November 2017
    Also, massive thanks to @KillMasterC for translating the text of these to Chinese!

    If you want 411 resources in other languages, there's a feedback option in the Line app, the 411 Facebook page can be messaged, or you can contact any of the people who work on it if you know them

    Forge XP:
    4af3a8eb7t5v.png


    Gold costs to rank:
    l48asiuhklof.png


    Gold cost per forge point:
    gtavtqkqv5p3.png


    Bot crystal shards
    mplxergw1154.png

  • SabugenSabugen Posts: 235
    edited November 2017
    n6hwydt5xu2d.jpg
    graphics version
  • What happened to 411 infobot? It has dissapeared from my Line app and can't seem to find it or add it.
  • Very weird. Nothing happened to the bot itself. You may have hidden it or deleted the chat history. Try going to to the Friend search tab, then searching for @tftf411bot";

    If that doesn't work, PM me your Line ID and I'll share it with you again

    908ybsp94hn4.jpeg
  • Do people forge 3*? Seems like it would be a bad move to forge bots now that we get chips from duping.
  • ManthroManthro Posts: 1,547
    Do people forge 3*? Seems like it would be a bad move to forge bots now that we get chips from duping.

    Look at it this way...

    Forging bots should lower your energon expenditure for difficult content.

    Sure, you miss out on a few feature chips, but the trade off is worth it. Most players only forge a bot when it's above Sig 30 or close to max Sig anyway. So at most you miss out on 1k chips per forged bot.. not a terrible sacrifice for what it accomplishes... A stronger 4* bot and some tasty 4* shards which may turn into 10k feature chips by drawing a 4* dupe
  • Do people forge 3*? Seems like it would be a bad move to forge bots now that we get chips from duping.

    It depends on what you are after. If you only want the 3* feature bot, then you are correct. However, the other way of looking at it is, if you forge your 3* bots you will get more 4* shards, thereby increasing your opportunities to dupe 4* bots. Each 4* dupe will get you 10000 shards towards that 4* feature, so if that is something that will increase your chances of cashing in on that, I would say forging 3* is an excellent choice.

    Further, it will also help if you dump all your 3* sig upgrades in to bots that you are going to forge, because they will produce even more 4* shards for you.
  • Booster_BlueBooster_Blue Posts: 312
    Do those who have a good 4* roster do that? I don't have many 4s yet so it would hurt more to lose some of my high sig 3*
  • TrailfireTrailfire Posts: 590
    edited January 1
    Don't forge your 3* till you aren't using them is my advice

    If you really need the forge XP you get from forging 3* bots, you'll know about it, and you wont mind consuming them at all
  • RemmieRemmie Posts: 156
    edited January 1
    So... Need clarification. I have a max rank/level og prime .. 3*, his sig is like 10-11. What type of 4* shards would I get from him?
  • RemmieRemmie Posts: 156
    Would it really only be a few hundred? With all the effort put into him??
  • CandKaneCandKane Posts: 590
    For max rank, sig level 10, you'll get (if I remember correctly) around 150-200 4* shards
  • RemmieRemmie Posts: 156
    Eek, that's too low. I'll wait to max the Sig then
  • RemmieRemmie Posts: 156
    edited January 2
    I won't forge my three star g1 til his sig is maxed, cause I'll also get that one time bonus and max forge lvl
  • TrailfireTrailfire Posts: 590
    You'll get those whether his sig ability is maxed or not. The most important question is whether you actually still use the 3* version, and do you need to be forging yet or are you still ranking your AM squad?

    If you need the 3* more than you need a boost to your top bot, then wait a bit. If your top bot isn't getting you through the toughest content easily enough and you can't increase ranks or levels directly, then it's time to forge :)
  • MutantdocMutantdoc Posts: 79
    I would like to point out this very useful table again for those who need help forging
Sign In or Register to comment.