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Sideswipe Balance Update

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  • Red_EyesRed_Eyes Posts: 994

    Synthwave wrote: »
    Synthwave wrote: »
    He still needs his Romance synergy with Windblade changed over to Arcee. Any way that could be added, post balancing?

    No. Arcee loved Hardhead and then settled with Aileron. Now she's Greenlight's significant other. In which continuity does she pair with Swipe?

    You see Hardhead, Aileron, or Greenlight in this game?

    Change the name from Romance to Comrades or Compatriots or something. But she and Sideswipe were very close. I don't even think Windblade and Sideswipe knew each other existed.

    They actually did meet:
  • ManthroManthro Posts: 2,752
    BrickT1973 wrote: »
    So...the ultimate question...


    Is sideswipe in the B-A tier level

    (As opposed to him being in D-C tier)

    Sideswipe was already an A-tier bot as far I’m concerned. You can use Sideswipe against everyone besides Bonecrusher. Technically he’s countered by Primal, but he’s strong enough that you can fight through him. You can even use him against Warriors and win, with his high power gain he can put out good damage against Scorponok to counter his nano-repair, and he can fight back against Arcee in two ways, her AI constantly shoots off ranged attacks for you to evade and gain power from, and she has a high chance to evade ranged attacks, but Sideswipe has no real reason to use his basic ranged attacks and he only has one ranged special attack.

    But why would you ever use sideswipe over another bot.

    THAT'S why he got buffed. He was useless. It's not that he wasn't good, it's because he is a 2nd rate choice compared to anything else. He was not a direct matchup or hard counter to any bot in the game, in any game mode.

    There was zero reason to spend resources on him over he utility you get from other scouts or other bots in the other classes.
  • Red_EyesRed_Eyes Posts: 994
    Synthwave wrote: »
    Also how did Hot Rod not make it into the Speed Chasers Synergy that Sideswipe is a part of?

    @Kabam Miike any chance you can talk to the team about some last minute Sideswipe synergy modifications before he goes live?

    Swapping Arcee out for Windblade on the Romance synergy and adding Hot Rod to Speed Chasers makes sense. They're pretty average synergies in and of themselves, so I don't think these changes would unbalance anything, but it would give some of the lesser used bots a little more visibility with the player base.

    Yeah Sideswipe and Hot Rod could probably do with some synergy buffs. I'm surprised Wheeljack didn't make the Speed Chasers (he is an Italian racing car after all) but in his case he has a a lot of synergies already so I can understand leaving him out.
  • SynthwaveSynthwave Posts: 1,012
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    Synthwave wrote: »
    Also how did Hot Rod not make it into the Speed Chasers Synergy that Sideswipe is a part of?

    @Kabam Miike any chance you can talk to the team about some last minute Sideswipe synergy modifications before he goes live?

    Swapping Arcee out for Windblade on the Romance synergy and adding Hot Rod to Speed Chasers makes sense. They're pretty average synergies in and of themselves, so I don't think these changes would unbalance anything, but it would give some of the lesser used bots a little more visibility with the player base.

    Yeah Sideswipe and Hot Rod could probably do with some synergy buffs. I'm surprised Wheeljack didn't make the Speed Chasers (he is an Italian racing car after all) but in his case he has a a lot of synergies already so I can understand leaving him out.

    I was thinking that too, but the Speed Chasers synergy seems more personality-based, in which case that would rule WJ out. Hot Rod, Sideswipe, Cheetor, and I guess DOTM Bee make sense.
  • BrickT1973BrickT1973 Posts: 334
    Manthro wrote: »
    BrickT1973 wrote: »
    So...the ultimate question...


    Is sideswipe in the B-A tier level

    (As opposed to him being in D-C tier)

    Sideswipe was already an A-tier bot as far I’m concerned. You can use Sideswipe against everyone besides Bonecrusher. Technically he’s countered by Primal, but he’s strong enough that you can fight through him. You can even use him against Warriors and win, with his high power gain he can put out good damage against Scorponok to counter his nano-repair, and he can fight back against Arcee in two ways, her AI constantly shoots off ranged attacks for you to evade and gain power from, and she has a high chance to evade ranged attacks, but Sideswipe has no real reason to use his basic ranged attacks and he only has one ranged special attack.

    But why would you ever use sideswipe over another bot.

    THAT'S why he got buffed. He was useless. It's not that he wasn't good, it's because he is a 2nd rate choice compared to anything else. He was not a direct matchup or hard counter to any bot in the game, in any game mode.

    There was zero reason to spend resources on him over he utility you get from other scouts or other bots in the other classes.

    I use Sideswipe for the same reasons I use Bludgeon or, to a lesser extent, Ironhide. None of them directly counter anyone, but they also aren’t countered by many. Sideswipe and Bludgeon can’t take Bonecrusher, most bots can’t, and Ironhide is a bad choice against Soundwave and Mirage, but outside of those few bots, I can use any of them against any bot of any class and win. That’s their strength. Now Sideswipe is a top tier murder machine but is still only countered by Bonecrusher.
  • Darm0kDarm0k Posts: 2,485
    Okay, so who’s expecting the 10 AM fights achievement to be with Sideswipe?
  • KittenKitten Posts: 1,897
    Darm0k wrote: »
    Okay, so who’s expecting the 10 AM fights achievement to be with Sideswipe?

    Oooh I hope not
  • KillMasterCKillMasterC Posts: 3,105
    Darm0k wrote: »
    Okay, so who’s expecting the 10 AM fights achievement to be with Sideswipe?

    Shock block path crowded..
  • Darm0k wrote: »
    Okay, so who’s expecting the 10 AM fights achievement to be with Sideswipe?

    wu5uuz3ml9qs.gif
  • SlayerSlayer Posts: 1,085
    So...the ultimate question...


    Is sideswipe in the B-A tier level

    (As opposed to him being in D-C tier)

    Kb is still better than sideswipe and you know where KB stands , right?
  • BrickT1973BrickT1973 Posts: 334
    Slayer wrote: »
    So...the ultimate question...


    Is sideswipe in the B-A tier level

    (As opposed to him being in D-C tier)

    Kb is still better than sideswipe and you know where KB stands , right?

    I know you ain’t disrespecting my boy Kickback like that
  • Decimus234Decimus234 Posts: 677
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    Synthwave wrote: »
    Synthwave wrote: »
    He still needs his Romance synergy with Windblade changed over to Arcee. Any way that could be added, post balancing?

    No. Arcee loved Hardhead and then settled with Aileron. Now she's Greenlight's significant other. In which continuity does she pair with Swipe?

    You see Hardhead, Aileron, or Greenlight in this game?

    Change the name from Romance to Comrades or Compatriots or something. But she and Sideswipe were very close. I don't even think Windblade and Sideswipe knew each other existed.

    They actually did meet:

    That show doesn’t count, I used to think sideswipe was at least an OK character, then that show shoved him down the garbage disposal.
  • SkBirdmanSkBirdman Posts: 391
    Decimus234 wrote: »
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    Synthwave wrote: »
    Synthwave wrote: »
    He still needs his Romance synergy with Windblade changed over to Arcee. Any way that could be added, post balancing?

    No. Arcee loved Hardhead and then settled with Aileron. Now she's Greenlight's significant other. In which continuity does she pair with Swipe?

    You see Hardhead, Aileron, or Greenlight in this game?

    Change the name from Romance to Comrades or Compatriots or something. But she and Sideswipe were very close. I don't even think Windblade and Sideswipe knew each other existed.

    They actually did meet:

    That show doesn’t count, I used to think sideswipe was at least an OK character, then that show shoved him down the garbage disposal.

    I quite liked RiD Sideswipe. Hes still the same stupid hot headed jock bot, just modernised and portrayed a bit younger, and not affected by war.
  • BrickT1973BrickT1973 Posts: 334
    SkBirdman wrote: »
    Decimus234 wrote: »
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    Synthwave wrote: »
    Synthwave wrote: »
    He still needs his Romance synergy with Windblade changed over to Arcee. Any way that could be added, post balancing?

    No. Arcee loved Hardhead and then settled with Aileron. Now she's Greenlight's significant other. In which continuity does she pair with Swipe?

    You see Hardhead, Aileron, or Greenlight in this game?

    Change the name from Romance to Comrades or Compatriots or something. But she and Sideswipe were very close. I don't even think Windblade and Sideswipe knew each other existed.

    They actually did meet:

    That show doesn’t count, I used to think sideswipe was at least an OK character, then that show shoved him down the garbage disposal.

    I quite liked RiD Sideswipe. Hes still the same stupid hot headed jock bot, just modernised and portrayed a bit younger, and not affected by war.

    But modernized characters are always a wrong take. RiD Sideswipe very much feels like a 2010s “cool character.” Whenever he talks, it’s pretty distinctly from this time period because it’s normally a lame joke or a childish insult.

    The G1 cartoon had timeless writing. It wasn’t normally good, but it was timeless. It wasn’t constantly spouting off references to the decade it was airing in and using any particular 80s dialogue. It was pretty childish, but G1 could have aired anytime in the 60s or the 70s or the 80s. If it had more consistently good animation, it could’ve been from the 90s or even the 2000s. Sunstreakers vain and always worried about his appearance, Jazz loves music and culture all around, Bumblebee gets along well with everyone, Optimus is a hero of the ages.

    The only thing really dating the show was the rock music that showed up every now and then. That
    SkBirdman wrote: »
    Decimus234 wrote: »
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    Synthwave wrote: »
    Synthwave wrote: »
    He still needs his Romance synergy with Windblade changed over to Arcee. Any way that could be added, post balancing?

    No. Arcee loved Hardhead and then settled with Aileron. Now she's Greenlight's significant other. In which continuity does she pair with Swipe?

    You see Hardhead, Aileron, or Greenlight in this game?

    Change the name from Romance to Comrades or Compatriots or something. But she and Sideswipe were very close. I don't even think Windblade and Sideswipe knew each other existed.

    They actually did meet:

    That show doesn’t count, I used to think sideswipe was at least an OK character, then that show shoved him down the garbage disposal.

    I quite liked RiD Sideswipe. Hes still the same stupid hot headed jock bot, just modernised and portrayed a bit younger, and not affected by war.

    He’s too modernized. Really that’s my main problem with the show. It has a lot of jokes and lines that feel distinctly generic and of this decade, with Sideswipe getting it the worst. All the jokes I remember have that same snarky and childish feel. It always sounds like a bad joke from the MCU has but dialed up to 11 and 10 times as common.

    I’d consider G1 a good show because it’s timelessly written. For the record, it’s not WELL written, but it’s timeless. All of it’s characters and writing were in the 80s, but if G1 came out at any point in the 60s or 70s it would have fit there. And if it’s animation was more consistently good, on say the movies level, it would’ve worked in the 90s and the 2000s. Optimus Prime was a timeless hero, Megatron was a relentless villain. Bumblebee befriended everyone he met, Jazz embraced their culture, Soundwave and Shockwave were eternal loyalists and Starscream always schemed. All of their personalities were classic and universal. RID, for the most part, feels like a very standard piece of media from the 2010s.

    Except the music. That random metal riff that showed up every now and then let’s you easily say “Yeah this is 80s.”
  • SkBirdmanSkBirdman Posts: 391
    Shows have to adjust to the times. Fans of the RiD series will probably be saying what your saying now about the latest Transformers show in 2030. G1 was a product of its time too.
  • Sideswipe needs an unblockable buff to unlock his potential
  • BrickT1973BrickT1973 Posts: 334
    SkBirdman wrote: »
    Shows have to adjust to the times. Fans of the RiD series will probably be saying what your saying now about the latest Transformers show in 2030. G1 was a product of its time too.

    In some ways it was, but I’d say G1 and the other fan favorite shows(Beast Wars, Animated, Prime) are highly regarded because while they’re dated in some ways, it’s dialed back more than other shows like the Unicron Trilogy or RID. I can see why people like it, but it is distinctly of its time. Shows have to adjust to their times a little bit, but I’d say shows are best when they’re more reserved in doing so.
  • RocsolidRocsolid Posts: 302
    I hate to advise you guys, but sideswipe is a direct counter to Rinox..... Suprised noone was aware of that....
  • Rocsolid wrote: »
    I hate to advise you guys, but sideswipe is a direct counter to Rinox..... Suprised noone was aware of that....

    Same with KickBack already, unless there's something in Sideswipe's kit that make him a better counter over KB. But still, that's pretty fire. I'll try this out sometime soon.
  • KillMasterCKillMasterC Posts: 3,105
    Rocsolid wrote: »
    I hate to advise you guys, but sideswipe is a direct counter to Rinox..... Suprised noone was aware of that....

    Same with KickBack already, unless there's something in Sideswipe's kit that make him a better counter over KB. But still, that's pretty fire. I'll try this out sometime soon.

    He more handsome, handsome is justice.
  • KillMasterCKillMasterC Posts: 3,105
    @Kabam Miike @Kabam Vydious Sorry to bring this up but it seems Sideswipe has to land his heavy to purify? Why in the world are you making his life harder, when every other heavy purification is done upon triggering (Mirage, Beast purification, Thundercracker, Kickback)?
  • @Kabam Miike @Kabam Vydious Sorry to bring this up but it seems Sideswipe has to land his heavy to purify? Why in the world are you making his life harder, when every other heavy purification is done upon triggering (Mirage, Beast purification, Thundercracker, Kickback)?

    I agree.

    Kabam, you have been working on sideswipe for ages , he still needs more though to make players consider using him.

    Please consider making his effects trigger upon starting his heavy AND upon landing the heavy ( so he doesn’t get shockblocked ).

    Also, how about a brief unblockable buff when he dodges a melee or starts a SP (buff timer frozen during SP ) ? That would make him able to land his hits and become the melee damage machine you envisaged.

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