Beat AM tronus without power control

小龙女小龙女 Posts: 640
edited September 18 in General Discussion
So is it even possible to beat tronus without taking even 1hp at D120 and above?

From my experience it is impossible to dodge like 10, 20 of his specials in a row. (Reliably)

This is due to his AI is coded so that he tends to fire it when u Backstep. But backstep is mandatory because u need to clear distance. If u want to clear distance by shooting and pushing him to his wall, then he can still fire special while u are shooting

There is no strategy on top of my head where u can reliably dodge 20, 30 of his specials...

(Wasp sp1 is different, cuz he likes to shoot and don’t like to dash and corner u, so clearing distance is rarely needed)

Comments

  • In my experience, it depends on how aggressive he is with firing specials. If he's holding back you will most likely get popped on a backstep as he tries to back you into the wall. If he's firing specials like an upstanding citizen, I can usually dodge them just fine. The unblockable mod forces you to dance around like crazy and he is definitely programmed to take advantage of that.
  • 小龙女小龙女 Posts: 640
    @Bi1b0Baggins so summary for your reply: not possible..
  • ManthroManthro Posts: 2,726
    1st... If you think he only grows specials when you backstep, you haven't figured out how to line him up to bait a special.

    Some bots have more specific setups that will reliably cause them to throw a special attack.

    Megatronus is best set up after he backsteps and shoots basic ranged. Sidestep up to avoid and then let him walk in.

    He will throw it fairly often in this scenario.


    2nd... Yes, he can be beaten without power control. Wasp, Tantrum, Motormaster, Cheetor (even though Cheetor sucks for AM in general) are all good candidates.

    WB is also a good choice because she is a great finisher.

    Starscream is also excellent even though he's at a class disadvantage.
  • Manthro wrote: »
    1st... If you think he only grows specials when you backstep, you haven't figured out how to line him up to bait a special.

    Some bots have more specific setups that will reliably cause them to throw a special attack.

    Megatronus is best set up after he backsteps and shoots basic ranged. Sidestep up to avoid and then let him walk in.

    He will throw it fairly often in this scenario.


    2nd... Yes, he can be beaten without power control. Wasp, Tantrum, Motormaster, Cheetor (even though Cheetor sucks for AM in general) are all good candidates.

    WB is also a good choice because she is a great finisher.

    Starscream is also excellent even though he's at a class disadvantage.

    Cheetor does pretty well for me in the greater scheme of AM, but since he power gains, he's not great for Tronus.
  • Manthro wrote: »
    1st... If you think he only grows specials when you backstep, you haven't figured out how to line him up to bait a special.

    Some bots have more specific setups that will reliably cause them to throw a special attack.

    Megatronus is best set up after he backsteps and shoots basic ranged. Sidestep up to avoid and then let him walk in.

    He will throw it fairly often in this scenario.


    2nd... Yes, he can be beaten without power control. Wasp, Tantrum, Motormaster, Cheetor (even though Cheetor sucks for AM in general) are all good candidates.

    WB is also a good choice because she is a great finisher.

    Starscream is also excellent even though he's at a class disadvantage.

    Thanks for that tip @Manthro , would you be kind enough to share fighting tips like that in another thread perhaps? I've always wondered if there were ways to "force" the opponent into stuff like that, e.g., I know holding block will sometimes trigger opponents to do something.
  • JKLJKL Posts: 744
    Yeah, beat him with OG and Tronus (not using any power steal). Sure, sometimes he can be a pain and hold to sp3. Not much you can do about that unless you are bad at baiting to start off with.
  • 小龙女小龙女 Posts: 640
    edited September 18
    JKL wrote: »
    Yeah, beat him with OG and Tronus (not using any power steal). Sure, sometimes he can be a pain and hold to sp3. Not much you can do about that unless you are bad at baiting to start off with.

    To be honest, I have no idea how to bait in general.

    The only thing I do:
    1. Against tronus and wasp and prowl I try to keep blocking until he fires it.
    2. Against all else I try to walk close to him.
    3. God like players or players with good reflect dash in to bait against certain bots. I am bad reflect, so I don’t do it in AM

    I have 0 idea how to bait special at far distance.

    What manthro said I actually don’t quite understand
  • Canuck33Canuck33 Posts: 243
    Just to expand on Manthro's point about baiting his special, it's almost like a very quick standoff where you are actually giving no input into a dash, dodge or ranged attack. This causes your bot to take the slightest natural step forward and that triggers the AI to fire their special thinking you're vulnerable. but you're ready for it and quickly sidestep and counter. Learn to master that technique and you can beat tronus in one shot without power control.

    This isn't just a range special tactic it works for every bot in the game and is extremely useful. I'll check on some vids to see if I have a good example
  • JKLJKL Posts: 744
    小龙女 wrote: »
    JKL wrote: »
    Yeah, beat him with OG and Tronus (not using any power steal). Sure, sometimes he can be a pain and hold to sp3. Not much you can do about that unless you are bad at baiting to start off with.

    To be honest, I have no idea how to bait in general.

    The only thing I do:
    1. Against tronus and wasp and prowl I try to keep blocking until he fires it.
    2. Against all else I try to walk close to him.
    3. God like players or players with good reflect dash in to bait against certain bots. I am bad reflect, so I don’t do it in AM

    I have 0 idea how to bait special at far distance.

    What manthro said I actually don’t quite understand



    This is for the other game but if I remember correctly, can apply the same concepts.
  • Canuck33Canuck33 Posts: 243
    the tutorial on walk the line is what i'm describing for sure. I wouldn't recommend walking too far though with the range factor in FTF, so try it but react quickly after your bot starts their movement. Sometimes it doesn't trigger the special, but that's ok cause your already sidestepping, this works very well usually.
  • Darm0kDarm0k Posts: 1,958
    Cheetor does pretty well for me in the greater scheme of AM, but since he power gains, he's not great for Tronus.

    Just avoid doing two medium hits in a combo or a S2 and you should not trigger his power gain.
  • 小龙女小龙女 Posts: 640
    edited September 18
    @JKL @Canuck33 Great video and tips!
    I see how walk the line works now.

    And technique 2 “while u were sleeping” is what I was talking about #3 if u have fast reflect u can dash into a knock down. But I don’t do it, a little too risky with my reflect lvl

    The basic principle is to keep your defense down and make AI think u are vulnerable. Walking the line shortens your distance vs AI, so all the more reason to fire special

    I think backstepping can easily catch u with special due to the longer animation to transition into side stepping, but walk the line is short walking animation and takes little time to transition into other animation (like sidestepping tronus special)
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