Home General Discussion
The Transformers Forged to Fight community has officially moved to Discord. For all the latest news and updates, join us here!

Please Explain 2

So bots are supposed to be invulnerable during specials, no?

Then why did my G1 Megatron just get hit with additional shocks while smashing down on Rhinox in tank form during an SP3??

Comments

  • SparkShredderSparkShredder Posts: 1,300
    Invulnerable to everything but Damaging Debuffs
  • SparkShredderSparkShredder Posts: 1,300
    They are invulnerable to everything which does damage or trigger abilities due to opponent's action..
    But here, you hit Rhinox, as his abilities say, you must get a shock,, same with BoneCrusher.
  • WolfmillsWolfmills Posts: 466
    Better question is when did firing a special attack start stopping all bleed, shock, and burn debuffs? Usually at 1% health
  • Red_EyesRed_Eyes Posts: 994
    They are invulnerable to everything which does damage or trigger abilities due to opponent's action..
    But here, you hit Rhinox, as his abilities say, you must get a shock,, same with BoneCrusher.

    I'm pretty sure there's a tip on the fight loading screen that says bots are "invulnerable" during specials. If what you say is true, that isn't really invulnerable.
  • ManthroManthro Posts: 2,752
    edited June 2018
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    So bots are supposed to be invulnerable during specials, no?

    Then why did my G1 Megatron just get hit with additional shocks while smashing down on Rhinox in tank form during an SP3??

    They are invulnerable to attack damage during specials, meaning they pass through them and do no damage during s1, s2 or s3 so you can intercept bots in mid attack. They will still trigger damaging debuffs such as BC bleeds and Rhinox shock. You take damage from those effects but they can't actually kill you during the s3 animation.

    It has always worked this way. There is no reason to change it.

    I find it interesting this bothers you during an s3, even though the same thing happens in s1 and s2.

    If you simply want to have the wording changed, sure. But bots with defensive abilities would be severely compromised by changing this mechanic, and in the case of Rhinox, make his exploding shields almost 100% useless since special attacks are one of the few times it will reliably trigger at all.

    What is the end result you want to get out of this thread?

  • KillMasterCKillMasterC Posts: 3,105
    edited June 2018
    Result: Kabam's wording skill improved --

    Bots are invulnerable during special except, including but not limited to the following cases, stated or implied to:
    1. ***
    2. ***
    3. ***
    4. ***
    5. ...
  • SparkShredderSparkShredder Posts: 1,300
    Result: Kabam's wording skill improved --

    Bots are invulnerable during special except, including but not limited to the following cases, stated or implied to:
    1. ***
    2. ***
    3. ***
    4. ***
    5. ...

    Bots are invulnerable to Attack Damage.

    That's enough as Attack damage don't include DoT damage
  • Darm0kDarm0k Posts: 2,485
    edited June 2018
    Wolfmills wrote: »
    Better question is when did firing a special attack start stopping all bleed, shock, and burn debuffs? Usually at 1% health

    Are you referring to a special attack other than a S3?
  • Red_EyesRed_Eyes Posts: 994
    I just saw it a little while ago, it says bots are invulnerable when using a special attack. Invulnerable is invulnerable so there shouldn't be any kind of damage, otherwise that statement is a lie. Don't try to explain it away, it is clear and simple, black and white.
  • Red_EyesRed_Eyes Posts: 994
    Definition of invulnerable
    1 : incapable of being wounded, injured, or harmed
    2 : immune to or proof against attack

    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/invulnerable
  • Red_EyesRed_Eyes Posts: 994
    I am not saying I expected purification of shocks already present, I am saying Rhinox inflicted new shocks during the sp3, "hit with additional shocks."

    That shouldn't be happening.
  • SparkShredderSparkShredder Posts: 1,300
    edited June 2018
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    I am not saying I expected purification of shocks already present, I am saying Rhinox inflicted new shocks during the sp3, "hit with additional shocks."

    That shouldn't be happening.

    It's megatron's fault , why did he inflicted attack damage more than 60% of his attack rating? he's invulnerable to their attacks, not damaging debuffs, and BC will also gift you bleeds your specials crit against him.
    So, Full and Final,, Invulnerable means to Attacks, not DoT debuff, they can be triggered by your special attacks unless you have espionage synergy active
    or Lord @Manthro can read you a whole book until you convince :D .
    Real Life Dictionary don't work here..... Go and buy "Kabam English Dictionary- Complete Guide to Fooling words in Our Games"
  • Red_EyesRed_Eyes Posts: 994
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    I am not saying I expected purification of shocks already present, I am saying Rhinox inflicted new shocks during the sp3, "hit with additional shocks."

    That shouldn't be happening.

    It's megatron's fault , why did he inflicted attack damage more than 60% of his attack rating? he's invulnerable to their attacks, not damaging debuffs, and BC will also gift you bleeds your specials crit against him.
    So, Full and Final,, Invulnerable means to Attacks, not DoT debuff, they can be triggered by your special attacks unless you have espionage synergy active
    or Lord @Manthro can read you a whole book until you convince :D .
    Real Life Dictionary don't work here..... Go and buy "Kabam English Dictionary- Complete Guide to Fooling words in Our Games"

    Invulnerable means you cannot be harmed in any way, learn the definition!

    Having a damaging debuff inflicted is an attack , it is harm being inflicted and that shouldn't be happening. That is not invulnerable.
  • DaveJLDaveJL Posts: 1,779
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    I am not saying I expected purification of shocks already present, I am saying Rhinox inflicted new shocks during the sp3, "hit with additional shocks."

    That shouldn't be happening.

    It's megatron's fault , why did he inflicted attack damage more than 60% of his attack rating? he's invulnerable to their attacks, not damaging debuffs, and BC will also gift you bleeds your specials crit against him.
    So, Full and Final,, Invulnerable means to Attacks, not DoT debuff, they can be triggered by your special attacks unless you have espionage synergy active
    or Lord @Manthro can read you a whole book until you convince :D .
    Real Life Dictionary don't work here..... Go and buy "Kabam English Dictionary- Complete Guide to Fooling words in Our Games"

    Invulnerable means you cannot be harmed in any way, learn the definition!

    Having a damaging debuff inflicted is an attack , it is harm being inflicted and that shouldn't be happening. That is not invulnerable.

    Yeah but look, in the context it is used within the game, everybody understands it and understands how it works and it's absolutely fine. You're just being pedantic and to be honest it's irritating. Make some constructive contributions rather than arguing the finer points of the definition of a word for a scenario nobody cares about
  • VoltronVoltron Posts: 998
    DaveJL wrote: »
    ...Make some constructive contributions rather than arguing the finer points of the definition of a word for a scenario...

    in all serious honesty..shouldn't you follow your own advice?
  • DaveJLDaveJL Posts: 1,779
    Voltron wrote: »
    DaveJL wrote: »
    ...Make some constructive contributions rather than arguing the finer points of the definition of a word for a scenario...

    in all serious honesty..shouldn't you follow your own advice?

    I joke around a lot, yes, but go read some of my serious posts or suggestions. I'm not getting whiney over literal definitions despite knowing how things work, I post about big issues and always have done.

    Those who know me, know that I'm not just a troll - I once made a huge, meta shifting change to MCoC when it was relatively young so I kind of know the difference between whining over semantics and genuinely broken functionality. This is whining.
  • SparkShredderSparkShredder Posts: 1,300
    @Red_Eyes Okay,, let me understand you with simple example... Rock is invulnerable to your attacks... Punch it, kick it it won't get affected...
    but pour a little acid to him and see how doesn't get affected....
    Similarly Bots are invulnerable to attacks but not DoT...

    Now, hope you get it...
  • ManthroManthro Posts: 2,752
    @Red_Eyes Okay,, let me understand you with simple example... Rock is invulnerable to your attacks... Punch it, kick it it won't get affected...
    but pour a little acid to him and see how doesn't get affected....
    Similarly Bots are invulnerable to attacks but not DoT...

    Now, hope you get it...

    Nah.. Look...

    If we are going by textbook definition, invulnerable is to be impervious to damage.

    Having said that... In the context of this game, invulnerable means impervious to basic and heavy attack damage.

    In order to take no damage from debuffs, you need to be immune to that specific debuff.

    Red_Eyes is correct in the definition of invulnerable, but it just doesn't apply to this game.

    It's not a big deal, change the wording of the on screen game tip if it means so much to some people, so players don't have a cow about it.

    There is no reason to change the game mechanics because of an incorrect description, it's been working fine for over a year
  • SparkShredderSparkShredder Posts: 1,300
    @Red_Eyes man look don't mess around real life definitions and laws of physics,, they don't work here.
  • SparkShredderSparkShredder Posts: 1,300
    Can you think a attack can be melee and ranged together... But primal heavy attack is
  • Darm0kDarm0k Posts: 2,485
    Can you think a attack can be melee and ranged together... But primal heavy attack is

    3jksyt6qiqqx.jpeg
  • Darm0kDarm0k Posts: 2,485
    I just think of it as invunerable to outside attack, but not inside. Like someone who is bulletproof, but ingests poison.
  • SparkShredderSparkShredder Posts: 1,300
    Darm0k wrote: »
    I just think of it as invunerable to outside attack, but not inside. Like someone who is bulletproof, but ingests poison.

    Good Example
  • Red_EyesRed_Eyes Posts: 994
    Darm0k wrote: »
    I just think of it as invunerable to outside attack, but not inside. Like someone who is bulletproof, but ingests poison.

    There is no variance with "invulnerable" you either are or you aren't. Kabam just says "invulnerable."

    @Kabam Miike can we get some official clarification here please. Kabam on the fight load screen has a tip that says bot are invulnerable during a special attack (I have a screenshot of it.) To me that clearly means that the attacking bot should not suffer new shocks during a special. I am not suggesting that shocks already present should not continue but it makes no sense for new ones to show up if a bot is supposed to be invulnerable. Apparently some people here don't understand what I am saying.



    If you don't like what I have to say, too bad for you. Move on and don't attack me or insult my intelligence, I will flag liberally.
  • Red_EyesRed_Eyes Posts: 994
    Voltron wrote: »
    DaveJL wrote: »
    ...Make some constructive contributions rather than arguing the finer points of the definition of a word for a scenario...

    in all serious honesty..shouldn't you follow your own advice?

    Thank you, I was just trying to have a simple conversation based on facts. I had no idea I would get attacked for no reason.
  • ManthroManthro Posts: 2,752
    edited June 2018
    Red_Eyes wrote: »
    Darm0k wrote: »
    I just think of it as invunerable to outside attack, but not inside. Like someone who is bulletproof, but ingests poison.

    There is no variance with "invulnerable" you either are or you aren't. Kabam just says "invulnerable."

    @Kabam Miike can we get some official clarification here please. Kabam on the fight load screen has a tip that says bot are invulnerable during a special attack (I have a screenshot of it.) To me that clearly means that the attacking bot should not suffer new shocks during a special. I am not suggesting that shocks already present should not continue but it makes no sense for new ones to show up if a bot is supposed to be invulnerable. Apparently some people here don't understand what I am saying.



    If you don't like what I have to say, too bad for you. Move on and don't attack me or insult my intelligence, I will flag liberally.

    As has been mentioned earlier (several times) invulnerable in the context of the game means impervious to basic and heavy attack damage. That's a fact, as this is how it has functioned since beta.

    Invulnerability to damaging debuffs requires immunity to said debuffs. That's why we have immune to bleed mods in spotlights and other special content.

    You don't need an admin or mod to confirm what everyone is already aware of, including yourself.

    Forums aren't just for getting answers from mods and admins, the rest of the community is here to provide it as well. That is the entire point of a forum.

    You may not like the answer you received but it's obviously correct in regard to the game mechanics, regardless of the dictionary definition.

    The issue is not that the people answering your question are incapable of understanding your argument... We get what you are saying.

    It's your inability to accept the functionality of how it works in the game.

    The real question now is:

    What course of action would satisfy you? There are 3 possible ways to deal with it:

    1) leave it be, no need to define it further
    2) change the game mechanics to fit the exact definition of the ability (bad idea imo)
    3) Change the game tip description to "impervious to all attack damage" in order to match how it actually functions
  • SparkShredderSparkShredder Posts: 1,300
    @Manthro ,,well, to me ,first option seems better...
    They won't follow second or third option just for a person's idea.
Sign In or Register to comment.