Can we talk about Windblade/arcees anatomical proportions?

Hello! I'm just gonna say this outright, I'm an artist I've been drawing for seven years and I believe that unless you work closely with anatomy and the human body you probably wouldn't notice this. I don't expect this to change, I'm not coming here to 'demand that kabam remodel their female bots!' I'm just bringing it up in a calm discussion. I'm also not trying to 'one up' the hard working people at kabam or trying to be disrespectful it's just something that irks me.

To put it mildly, both Windblade and Arcees anatomical proportions are way off, even including the fact that they're robots and it frustrates me to no end because I like the designs of both of them, but the proportions just make me hate the model. It's more obvious with Arcee so I took some screenshots to try and help show what I mean.

pwafewgcxmcg.png
9opto6mf3ltb.png

Like I said, it's not a major thing, not desperately needing to change and I'm not trying to show up anyone I'm just pointing out that for both female transformers it's a lot more obvious that the models aren't on proportion. I apologise if I sound disrespectful I just thought I'd bring up something that's been annoying me for a while as someone who works around anatomy.
Thank you for your time!
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Comments

  • I'm not sure what your point of comparison is here. They seem roughly in the same proportions as the toys they're based on. Just like the many non-female character designs are.
  • HypnotunezHypnotunez Posts: 30
    edited November 2019
    I'm not sure what your point of comparison is here. They seem roughly in the same proportions as the toys they're based on. Just like the many non-female character designs are.

    They are based off of the toys yes, but generation Arcee has her hands more or less like the edited model on the right. Hands do not reach the knees of a generalised normal humanoid shape, they at most reach the middle of the thighs. The forearms are also meant to be longer than the upper arm (in which the toy too has that problem) and thighs are also longer than the calf. Hands should also not be that large compared to the face(which are generally the same size from chin to forehead) What I'm meaning is that for a 3D model it's not as difficult to get the proportions right and while it's not necessarily a problem it's just fustrating how weird it looks.
    Edit:
    Also while it may be based off of the toy there's no need for it to be the exact same when it comes to artistic impression
  • Hypnotunez wrote: »
    I'm not sure what your point of comparison is here. They seem roughly in the same proportions as the toys they're based on. Just like the many non-female character designs are.

    They are based off of the toys yes, but generation Arcee has her hands more or less like the edited model on the right. Hands do not reach the knees of a generalised normal humanoid shape, they at most reach the middle of the thighs. The forearms are also meant to be longer than the upper arm (in which the toy too has that problem) and thighs are also longer than the calf. Hands should also not be that large compared to the face(which are generally the same size from chin to forehead) What I'm meaning is that for a 3D model it's not as difficult to get the proportions right and while it's not necessarily a problem it's just fustrating how weird it looks.
    Edit:
    Also while it may be based off of the toy there's no need for it to be the exact same when it comes to artistic impression

    You definitely improved the model. I did’t even notice the hands until you pointed them out. 👍🏻
  • KillMasterCKillMasterC Posts: 2,940
    Hypnotunez wrote: »
    I'm not sure what your point of comparison is here. They seem roughly in the same proportions as the toys they're based on. Just like the many non-female character designs are.

    They are based off of the toys yes, but generation Arcee has her hands more or less like the edited model on the right. Hands do not reach the knees of a generalised normal humanoid shape, they at most reach the middle of the thighs. The forearms are also meant to be longer than the upper arm (in which the toy too has that problem) and thighs are also longer than the calf. Hands should also not be that large compared to the face(which are generally the same size from chin to forehead) What I'm meaning is that for a 3D model it's not as difficult to get the proportions right and while it's not necessarily a problem it's just fustrating how weird it looks.
    Edit:
    Also while it may be based off of the toy there's no need for it to be the exact same when it comes to artistic impression

    You definitely improved the model. I did’t even notice the hands until you pointed them out. 👍🏻

    Now Arcee can miss her combos :D
  • Hypnotunez wrote: »
    I'm not sure what your point of comparison is here. They seem roughly in the same proportions as the toys they're based on. Just like the many non-female character designs are.

    They are based off of the toys yes, but generation Arcee has her hands more or less like the edited model on the right. Hands do not reach the knees of a generalised normal humanoid shape, they at most reach the middle of the thighs. The forearms are also meant to be longer than the upper arm (in which the toy too has that problem) and thighs are also longer than the calf. Hands should also not be that large compared to the face(which are generally the same size from chin to forehead) What I'm meaning is that for a 3D model it's not as difficult to get the proportions right and while it's not necessarily a problem it's just fustrating how weird it looks.
    Edit:
    Also while it may be based off of the toy there's no need for it to be the exact same when it comes to artistic impression

    You definitely improved the model. I did’t even notice the hands until you pointed them out. 👍🏻

    To be fair I'm not sure something someone would realise unless they worked with anatomy, many others said the same thing but all of my fellow artist friends figured out immediately what was wrong. The reason why we can't walk on all fours is because our arms are much shorter than our legs, Arcee can basically do that.
  • I don’t know what the hell to say to this. There’s only so much detail they can get into an action figure. It’s not their fault. Leave the kabam animators alone.
  • VoltronVoltron Posts: 858
    why is this only for Arcee and Windblade? the arm ending at the knee applies to every bot
  • HypnotunezHypnotunez Posts: 30
    edited November 2019
    Beastdad wrote: »
    Someone needs to spend more time outdoors.

    You know what is "frustrating" OP? The many bugs that are still around in the game, not the way the bots look.

    I did say I don't expect it to change and that it's not necessarily a problem. I'm not here to start an argument if you could leave your vitriol by the door. If it was an issue or bug I would have put it in the 'bugs and known issues' this is a discussion, not me pestering the devs to recreate an entire model, this is me starting a friendly discussion about the models and seeing if anyone else noticed, thank you for your time.
  • Decimus234 wrote: »
    I don’t know what the hell to say to this. There’s only so much detail they can get into an action figure. It’s not their fault. Leave the kabam animators alone.

    I'm not getting on their case, I'm just starting a discussion with something I noticed I'm also not blaming them at all.
  • Voltron wrote: »
    why is this only for Arcee and Windblade? the arm ending at the knee applies to every bot
    It's more obvious with the thinner models is all, it would be pretty annoying if I just threw lots of screenshots into the forum.
  • Beastdad wrote: »
    Someone needs to spend more time outdoors.

    You know what is "frustrating" OP? The many bugs that are still around in the game, not the way the bots look.

    To each their own...frustrating is an opinion not a fact so therefore what's frustrating to her may not be frustrating to you...it's surely not frustrating to me as I never experience Bugs...at least not on the regular...
  • Beastdad wrote: »
    Hypnotunez wrote: »
    Beastdad wrote: »
    Someone needs to spend more time outdoors.

    You know what is "frustrating" OP? The many bugs that are still around in the game, not the way the bots look.

    I did say I don't expect it to change and that it's not necessarily a problem. I'm not here to start an argument if you could leave your vitriol by the door. If it was an issue or bug I would have put it in the 'bugs and known issues' this is a discussion, not me pestering the devs to recreate an entire model, this is me starting a friendly discussion about the models and seeing if anyone else noticed, thank you for your time.

    Cute.

    The truth is, this was some weird way to "flex" and announce to the world you are an "artist". (I could not care less if you trash Kabam all day, I can count the number of times on one hand that I have ever stuck up for them) I agree with your points about the proportions being off, and no I never really paid attention to it prior to today.

    You used the words "annoying" and "frustrating" in describing your "issue", and to some of us it is pretty pointless and we are voicing that back to you.

    First rule of being an artist, if you can't take the criticism, don't throw your hat in the ring.

    I like how you think I'm flaunting the fact that I'm an artist. It's the same if someone says 'I'm a doctor myself' I'm not making myself better I'm merely stating a fact of what I am to provide context to how I realised this. It's purely factual and me being an artist does not make me better or above anyone else. Using words like 'annoying' and 'frustrating' is me stating my opinion on things and how I feel about it. And if you feel that this post is pointless so be it, you don't have to be needlessly aggressive just state you don't find any point in what I'm saying, there that's your opinion done. I don't understand why you feel the need to be so aggressive at all and yes 'if you can't take the criticism don't ask for it' I hear that a lot and somehow people think that gives them to right to just be abrasive and rude instead of applying any relevant feedback.
  • Beastdad wrote: »
    Hypnotunez wrote: »
    Beastdad wrote: »
    Hypnotunez wrote: »
    Beastdad wrote: »
    Someone needs to spend more time outdoors.

    You know what is "frustrating" OP? The many bugs that are still around in the game, not the way the bots look.

    I did say I don't expect it to change and that it's not necessarily a problem. I'm not here to start an argument if you could leave your vitriol by the door. If it was an issue or bug I would have put it in the 'bugs and known issues' this is a discussion, not me pestering the devs to recreate an entire model, this is me starting a friendly discussion about the models and seeing if anyone else noticed, thank you for your time.

    Cute.

    The truth is, this was some weird way to "flex" and announce to the world you are an "artist". (I could not care less if you trash Kabam all day, I can count the number of times on one hand that I have ever stuck up for them) I agree with your points about the proportions being off, and no I never really paid attention to it prior to today.

    You used the words "annoying" and "frustrating" in describing your "issue", and to some of us it is pretty pointless and we are voicing that back to you.

    First rule of being an artist, if you can't take the criticism, don't throw your hat in the ring.

    I like how you think I'm flaunting the fact that I'm an artist. It's the same if someone says 'I'm a doctor myself' I'm not making myself better I'm merely stating a fact of what I am to provide context to how I realised this. It's purely factual and me being an artist does not make me better or above anyone else. Using words like 'annoying' and 'frustrating' is me stating my opinion on things and how I feel about it. And if you feel that this post is pointless so be it, you don't have to be needlessly aggressive just state you don't find any point in what I'm saying, there that's your opinion done. I don't understand why you feel the need to be so aggressive at all and yes 'if you can't take the criticism don't ask for it' I hear that a lot and somehow people think that gives them to right to just be abrasive and rude instead of applying any relevant feedback.

    It may be time to invest in a dictionary, I don't think you have a handle on the word "aggressive".

    You asked for opinions, and you got one.

    And neither do you. Regardless thank you for your opinion in this discussion.
  • BaRdYaAmNBaRdYaAmN Posts: 1,496
    edited November 2019
    As much as I'd love to talk about women's"proportions", I don't really get it in this case. Is it just me?
  • She's a damn good artist too XD
  • BaRdYaAmN wrote: »
    As much as I'd love to talk about women's"proportions", I don't really get it in this case. Is it just me?

    For the models, the arms are too long and the length of the calves and thighs are swapped around which gives them the gorilla hands look.
  • Hypnotunez wrote: »
    Hello! I'm just gonna say this outright, I'm an artist I've been drawing for seven years and I believe that unless you work closely with anatomy and the human body you probably wouldn't notice this. I don't expect this to change, I'm not coming here to 'demand that kabam remodel their female bots!' I'm just bringing it up in a calm discussion. I'm also not trying to 'one up' the hard working people at kabam or trying to be disrespectful it's just something that irks me.

    To put it mildly, both Windblade and Arcees anatomical proportions are way off, even including the fact that they're robots and it frustrates me to no end because I like the designs of both of them, but the proportions just make me hate the model. It's more obvious with Arcee so I took some screenshots to try and help show what I mean.

    pwafewgcxmcg.png
    9opto6mf3ltb.png

    Like I said, it's not a major thing, not desperately needing to change and I'm not trying to show up anyone I'm just pointing out that for both female transformers it's a lot more obvious that the models aren't on proportion. I apologise if I sound disrespectful I just thought I'd bring up something that's been annoying me for a while as someone who works around anatomy.
    Thank you for your time!

    They’re not human. Your argument is therefore invalid.
  • BlackRazakBlackRazak Posts: 2,658
    edited November 2019
    @Hypnotunez
    sz0ob6bwvvuu.jpg
    He HATES his anatomical proportions!

    TBF, though, G1 bots have ALWAYS had "man in suit" proportions, so OP has a point, @FamiGami .
    Yes, even Omega Supreme, or any bipedal character that's NOT A SHARKTICON EXECUTIONER/QUINTESSON.

    Let OP have his nitpicky thread! :smiley:
  • BlackRazak wrote: »
    @Hypnotunez
    sz0ob6bwvvuu.jpg
    He HATES his anatomical proportions!

    TBF, though, G1 bots have ALWAYS had "man in suit" proportions, so OP has a point, @FamiGami .
    Yes, even Omega Supreme, or any bipedal character that's NOT A SHARKTICON EXECUTIONER/QUINTESSON.

    Let OP have his nitpicky thread! :smiley:

    OP is a her not a him
  • PeasPeas Posts: 69
    edited November 2019
    I was just noticing this about Arcee the other day. Funny how now there’s a post about it.
    Anyway, to the OP, you nailed Arcee with your edit. The arms were too long and hands too big. Now how can I get your version into my game? 😜
  • One error in both Arcee models posted above, is the head being disproportionately smaller than it should be on a body that size. And that's an error common to a lot of Transformers, becoming more obvious the bigger the Transformer is (Combiner and Titans have heads way smaller than they should be)--And yes, I do have the new Omega Supreme who also has upper arms the same size as his shoulders (not long at all and making poseability an issue with his arms). Plus the cannon in the back of his head is tiny too.

    Windblade's perceived disproportionality is covered by the fact that she is covered--in armor. And that armor is likely designed for maximum movement and protection. Both fembots also have arms that seem elongated to compensate for a lack of reach their compact frames would have compared to every other bot in the game. Remember, they're built for fighting, for combat, not to be robot super models. Their hands are overly large, but to me, that seems to be not so much an anatomical error as it is to show their hands in detail, given that their hands would be too small to clearly see if they were perfectly portioned to their forearms and overall build. As models, and even as toys, they would be out of proportion and not look good, but for a game designed to be played on a phone, their models are just fine for me.
  • 489mr2h2a3n4.jpeg
    How about these proportions?
  • BlackRazakBlackRazak Posts: 2,658
    edited November 2019
    Mutantdoc wrote: »
    489mr2h2a3n4.jpeg
    How about these proportions?

    Windblade WANTS IN
    3qzqie42q5ih.jpg
    5bydd8bpyle2.jpg

    TBF @Mutantdoc those are amazing, the FireBird girls ACTUALLY TRANSFORM.
    Curvy bot design, but superb vehicle modes.
    HASBRO could learn a lot.

  • Peas wrote: »
    I was just noticing this about Arcee the other day. Funny how now there’s a post about it.
    Anyway, to the OP, you nailed Arcee with your edit. The arms were too long and hands too big. Now how can I get your version into my game? 😜

    Why thank you!
  • One error in both Arcee models posted above, is the head being disproportionately smaller than it should be on a body that size. And that's an error common to a lot of Transformers, becoming more obvious the bigger the Transformer is (Combiner and Titans have heads way smaller than they should be)--And yes, I do have the new Omega Supreme who also has upper arms the same size as his shoulders (not long at all and making poseability an issue with his arms). Plus the cannon in the back of his head is tiny too.

    Windblade's perceived disproportionality is covered by the fact that she is covered--in armor. And that armor is likely designed for maximum movement and protection. Both fembots also have arms that seem elongated to compensate for a lack of reach their compact frames would have compared to every other bot in the game. Remember, they're built for fighting, for combat, not to be robot super models. Their hands are overly large, but to me, that seems to be not so much an anatomical error as it is to show their hands in detail, given that their hands would be too small to clearly see if they were perfectly portioned to their forearms and overall build. As models, and even as toys, they would be out of proportion and not look good, but for a game designed to be played on a phone, their models are just fine for me.

    Yes I do see why it doesn't matter to some and your points are true, I think it just depends on the person, some people like the design, some people prefer a more accurate design it's up for debate. Practicality does also need to come into play you're right!
  • BlackRazak wrote: »
    @Hypnotunez
    sz0ob6bwvvuu.jpg
    He HATES his anatomical proportions!

    TBF, though, G1 bots have ALWAYS had "man in suit" proportions, so OP has a point, @FamiGami .
    Yes, even Omega Supreme, or any bipedal character that's NOT A SHARKTICON EXECUTIONER/QUINTESSON.

    Let OP have his nitpicky thread! :smiley:
    Haha yes, bayformers do get on my nerves but for entirely different reasons that completely overpower slight disproportions. I am aware I'm being nitpicky I'm not rushing into this thinking I'm entirely right. Some of the bots, mostly the toys look better with less accurate anatomy it's just with some it's glaringly obvious that it makes your ape brain go 'that's not right?'
  • Hypnotunez wrote: »
    BlackRazak wrote: »
    @Hypnotunez
    sz0ob6bwvvuu.jpg
    He HATES his anatomical proportions!

    TBF, though, G1 bots have ALWAYS had "man in suit" proportions, so OP has a point, @FamiGami .
    Yes, even Omega Supreme, or any bipedal character that's NOT A SHARKTICON EXECUTIONER/QUINTESSON.

    Let OP have his nitpicky thread! :smiley:
    Haha yes, bayformers do get on my nerves but for entirely different reasons that completely overpower slight disproportions. I am aware I'm being nitpicky I'm not rushing into this thinking I'm entirely right. Some of the bots, mostly the toys look better with less accurate anatomy it's just with some it's glaringly obvious that it makes your ape brain go 'that's not right?'

    Go bots Optimus primal makes my brain go “that’s not right”
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