An exploit or hack is a third party thing that you need to install to your device to give you an unfair advantage. Wasp sig is an in-built ability by the game developers that is usable by everyone in the game. Think it’s unfair? Well, nothing to stop you from doing the same thing. This does not violate any TOS.
Besides, wasp isn’t the only bot that you can use. If you want to nerf, you’ll need to nerf wheeljack-nano repair, MV-heal with bleed, Megatronus, demo Megatron, etc. So not too sure where Kabam should or can draw the line.
This is more of a loophole than a cheat or a hack. Synthwave’s suggestion of adjusting the timers and KO’ing the bots when it runs out closes this without having to nerf any of the bots.
The difference is the other bots you name die unlike wasp. Big difference!
Well, wasp is open for everyone to choose to use or not to use. Just because you choose not to use it, means everyone else cannot use it? You got upset when Kabam said nerfing your base is “collusion” and players accused Kabam of trying to control what players put on their bases. So why are you now trying to control how other players play? It’s not like it’s only limited to selected players. It’s open to everyone to do so. Go ahead and use it then. There’s no unfair advantage because everyone can take advantage of this.
An exploit or hack is a third party thing that you need to install to your device to give you an unfair advantage. Wasp sig is an in-built ability by the game developers that is usable by everyone in the game. Think it’s unfair? Well, nothing to stop you from doing the same thing. This does not violate any TOS.
Besides, wasp isn’t the only bot that you can use. If you want to nerf, you’ll need to nerf wheeljack-nano repair, MV-heal with bleed, Megatronus, demo Megatron, etc. So not too sure where Kabam should or can draw the line.
That's correct, everyone can use it. Which is why Kabam will change it because it will mean the end of a revenue stream for them if nobody needs to spend on repairs/revives.
And your other examples, as Jay accurately pointed out, are an apples and oranges comparison. Dark burn or any other kind of damage-over-time effect can kill Wheeljack (I should know, Galvatron just nearly one-shotted my Wheeljack with a heavy attack in AM; it burned through almost all 3 of his shields). Wheeljack doesn't come back to life after that. Same with MV1. His signature can be outright bypassed by several bot abilities where he can be KO'd and not come back. Demotron, same thing. Waspinator is the only bot that truly comes back to life and gives the player a chance to pause the game, time the fight out, and then do it all over again.
All of this is just semantics at this point anyway. What Kabam worries about is making money to keep the game profitable and going and a bot that can infinitely come back to life every fight won't make them money. If they can nerf Ratchet, they can certainly change Waspinator's sig or just make timeouts be a KO.
That's the important thing to take away from all of this; this is Kabam's game and they can make whatever changes they want. Guess time will tell though.
Surprisingly and sadly. Im sure these players would still exploit even if it was 15 minutes.
@Faithz17 barely anyone actually wants to use wasp so GTFO with that crap. Stop beating around the bush just because you want to stay in top 3. You very well know you don't belong there.
If Kabam (@Kabam Miike) would like to make an official clarification whether using Wasp like this is allowed or not, we could put this issue to rest and move on.
If Kabam (@Kabam Miike) would like to make an official clarification whether using Wasp like this is allowed or not, we could put this issue to rest and move on.
If okay then R4 5* Wasp coming soon
Miike likes to leave us all in suspension for a little while before creeping out to make an appearance. I'm sure when the time comes, and everyone fires all their bullets, Miike will show up and give us his statement.
Miike likes to leave us all in suspension for a little while before creeping out to make an appearance. I'm sure when the time comes, and everyone fires all their bullets, Miike will show up and give us his statement.
Perhaps we get the "This thread has become non-constructive and personal, for that reason I will be shutting this thread down."
Manthro the Chinese have time for 15 minute timers. And Faith17 stop being a know it all! You are simply a pretender of an exploit your Alliance have nicely abused.
All other Bots Die and not Revive! So stop your non sense about Waspinator Sig and abilities. Try and kill bots like most of us Do!
Peace out! @miike Kabam the floor is yours!
Miike likes to leave us all in suspension for a little while before creeping out to make an appearance. I'm sure when the time comes, and everyone fires all their bullets, Miike will show up and give us his statement.
Perhaps we get the "This thread has become non-constructive and personal, for that reason I will be shutting this thread down."
That would be the same as them saying “we’re ok with you all exploiting waspinator’s signature ability in am”, right?
If Kabam (@Kabam Miike) would like to make an official clarification whether using Wasp like this is allowed or not, we could put this issue to rest and move on.
If okay then R4 5* Wasp coming soon
This is using intended functionality in an unintended way that can be exploited, and it is something that we want to address. What that means, we don't know right now. There have been a lot of great suggestions in here regarding timers, timeout penalties, or alterations to Waspinator's signature ability/how often it works, and we have been discussing these ideas.
We do find this behavior concerning as well, but don’t currently have confirmation on how/when we might tackle it.. If you want to rank up Waspinator for this, that's up to you, but keep in mind we might make changes to the mode or the Bot in the future.
We really appreciate the concern that you guys have raised over this, and have received a lot of messages from many of you in regards to this. We're sorry we can't be more specific at this time.
If Kabam (@Kabam Miike) would like to make an official clarification whether using Wasp like this is allowed or not, we could put this issue to rest and move on.
If okay then R4 5* Wasp coming soon
This is using intended functionality in an unintended way that can be exploited, and it is something that we want to address. What that means, we don't know right now. There have been a lot of great suggestions in here regarding timers, timeout penalties, or alterations to Waspinator's signature ability/how often it works, and we have been discussing these ideas.
We do find this behavior concerning as well, but don’t currently have confirmation on how/when we might tackle it.. If you want to rank up Waspinator for this, that's up to you, but keep in mind we might make changes to the mode or the Bot in the future.
We really appreciate the concern that you guys have raised over this, and have received a lot of messages from many of you in regards to this. We're sorry we can't be more specific at this time.
Thanks for showing up and shedding some light on this topic. We appreciate it.
But it seems to me that you are telling us that if we want to exploit this, we are allowed to do so. But at some point in the future, there might be changes that will adjust this matter so it will no longer be an exploit and that we shouldn't be mad about ranking wasp if we do so.
It's sad to hear some talk about using the exploit like it's morally ok, in the context of this game. Like, how far will you go to get ahead, in real life? It's a little scary and causes me to lose more faith in humanity, no pun intended. I hope at some point in the future, that this, and other similar games will truly be won by merit of skill, and not who can exploit the game the hardest.
If Kabam (@Kabam Miike) would like to make an official clarification whether using Wasp like this is allowed or not, we could put this issue to rest and move on.
If okay then R4 5* Wasp coming soon
This is using intended functionality in an unintended way that can be exploited, and it is something that we want to address. What that means, we don't know right now. There have been a lot of great suggestions in here regarding timers, timeout penalties, or alterations to Waspinator's signature ability/how often it works, and we have been discussing these ideas.
We do find this behavior concerning as well, but don’t currently have confirmation on how/when we might tackle it.. If you want to rank up Waspinator for this, that's up to you, but keep in mind we might make changes to the mode or the Bot in the future.
We really appreciate the concern that you guys have raised over this, and have received a lot of messages from many of you in regards to this. We're sorry we can't be more specific at this time.
Thanks for showing up and shedding some light on this topic. We appreciate it.
But it seems to me that you are telling us that if we want to exploit this, we are allowed to do so. But at some point in the future, there might be changes that will adjust this matter so it will no longer be an exploit and that we shouldn't be mad about ranking wasp if we do so.
If this is ok I wonder why the so called collusion with some folks lowering there base difficulties to make it easier to raid we a problem? (Still not sure how they did it with revenge being broke and opponents random)
@Kabam Miike, it sounds like you're talking out of both sides of your mouth here and it's very confusing. On one side you're saying you know it can be exploited, but the other side of your mouth is saying, "what that means, we don't really know?"
How could you guys not know what that means when you just said you know what it means? lol
What some people are going to interpret this confusing statement as is instead of "we don't know what this means" is that they're going to read it as "we're too busy with other things, too (fill-in-the-blank) to care about changing this even though we know it's messing everything up.
You know what you guys sound like? You guys sound tired. Like that tired, grumpy old man who just can't be bothered to do anything about anything because life has beat them down and they just don't care anymore. That's what that statement sounds like.
Where did that young, spry, decisive development team we all knew and loved go? The one that nerfed Ratchet's overpowered heal with a surprisingly balanced interpretation of him? The team that used to do fun interviews with the guys who worked on the bots themselves on the Game Updates page, before it was converted into a mausoleum?
You guys just sound resigned, which doesn't sound good to us. Is there something you want to share with the rest of us?
As you mentioned, people here have listed some great solutions. How about acting on one of them? Waspinator is a bot who is low on the popularity scale with the majority of players but who also has an incredibly exploitable signature ability. How do you want to fix it?
Pick one of these:
1. Change the signature ability. Not the easiest course by any means, but it would also mean balancing a bot that has desperately needed some buffs in certain areas. This would be the chance to do that and chalk up a win with the community who has been asking for this for over a year now. Not my first choice, as I want something more immediate, but it would also be nice to have him crossed off my list of bots who need re-balancing.
2. A. Change the AM timer so that we have more time on the timer and/or a time out equals a KO. Changing the timer to 60 minutes would be the easiest, fastest fix for this, as he still gets to use his signature ability.
B. Changing it to 8 minutes + time out equals KO would probably be the next best solution, but a little more work and probably not as popular, as people seem to not have positive reactions to that phrase, KO.
3. Temporarily lock Waspinator out of AM until you can decide between options 1 and 2A or 2B.
Pick one of these ASAP and please get back to us to let us know what choice you've made. Even if you went with solution 2A and said, "this is temporary until we can come up with something else" I think everyone would be OK with that. Just please, no more with the "we'll get back to you in the near future" stuff. We've heard tons of that rhetoric already with regards to the new content threads and it doesn't fly very well here these days.
@Kabam Miike, it sounds like you're talking out of both sides of your mouth here and it's very confusing. On one side you're saying you know it can be exploited, but the other side of your mouth is saying, "what that means, we don't really know?"
as in, they don't know how they will address this exploit as of right now
@Kabam Miike I'm not trying to sound all gloom and doom but consider there are consequences to delaying a solution to this Wasp issue. I could probably run with Wasp at any level and use zero or very minimal items. Any alliance with time now can effectively run any AM level they want as long as they use the Wasp strategy. How this plays out is that alliances will eventually all have to run map 3 D100 and use Wasp (if they want a chance at top 3 rewards or maybe even top 10+). Placement will be determined by random shark points. You pretty much push down any alliance not using the Wasp strategy. Eventually, you may even have alliances recruiting with the message "Top placing AM alliance, must run min. 4* Wasp." You see where this can go? No action on Kabam's part effectively ruins AM.
I understand it's a loophole anyone can take advantage of but why make AMs into something like that? It's suppose to be one of bigger challenge modes of this game. An actual test of skill and not a grind fest waiting for TOs. Rewards were already dated compare to other game modes but this makes it even less of a reason to play at high levels.
Since you've already stated this is an exploit, Kabam could make an official announcement to the player base that this strategy is not allowed. Any player caught using is gets the 7 day ban, second offense gets a permanent ban. This is probably not in the best interest of Kabam so please decide with your team what course of action you would like to take to protect the players and Kabam's revenue side. Hurry though, this is not one of those issues that should take months to resolve.
If Kabam (@Kabam Miike) would like to make an official clarification whether using Wasp like this is allowed or not, we could put this issue to rest and move on.
If okay then R4 5* Wasp coming soon
This is using intended functionality in an unintended way that can be exploited, and it is something that we want to address. What that means, we don't know right now. There have been a lot of great suggestions in here regarding timers, timeout penalties, or alterations to Waspinator's signature ability/how often it works, and we have been discussing these ideas.
We do find this behavior concerning as well, but don’t currently have confirmation on how/when we might tackle it.. If you want to rank up Waspinator for this, that's up to you, but keep in mind we might make changes to the mode or the Bot in the future.
We really appreciate the concern that you guys have raised over this, and have received a lot of messages from many of you in regards to this. We're sorry we can't be more specific at this time.
Although you guys are addressing this issue when can we expect updated am rewards? Am rewards were somewhat useful months ago but now that everyone is getting better we need proper rewards to help us progress faster.
@Kabam Miike I'm not trying to sound all gloom and doom but consider there are consequences to delaying a solution to this Wasp issue. I could probably run with Wasp at any level and use zero or very minimal items. Any alliance with time now can effectively run any AM level they want as long as they use the Wasp strategy. How this plays out is that alliances will eventually all have to run map 3 D100 and use Wasp (if they want a chance at top 3 rewards or maybe even top 10+). Placement will be determined by random shark points. You pretty much push down any alliance not using the Wasp strategy. Eventually, you may even have alliances recruiting with the message "Top placing AM alliance, must run min. 4* Wasp." You see where this can go? No action on Kabam's part effectively ruins AM.
I understand it's a loophole anyone can take advantage of but why make AMs into something like that? It's suppose to be one of bigger challenge modes of this game. An actual test of skill and not a grind fest waiting for TOs. Rewards were already dated compare to other game modes but this makes it even less of a reason to play at high levels.
Since you've already stated this is an exploit, Kabam could make an official announcement to the player base that this strategy is not allowed. Any player caught using is gets the 7 day ban, second offense gets a permanent ban. This is probably not in the best interest of Kabam so please decide with your team what course of action you would like to take to protect the players and Kabam's revenue side. Hurry though, this is not one of those issues that should take months to resolve.
@Ænigma what is your ign? I’m curious what makes you the judge of who should be top 3 or not. Do you even know us? Do we know you? Maybe you can try playing with us to get to know us better.
If Kabam (@Kabam Miike) would like to make an official clarification whether using Wasp like this is allowed or not, we could put this issue to rest and move on.
If okay then R4 5* Wasp coming soon
This is using intended functionality in an unintended way that can be exploited, and it is something that we want to address. What that means, we don't know right now. There have been a lot of great suggestions in here regarding timers, timeout penalties, or alterations to Waspinator's signature ability/how often it works, and we have been discussing these ideas.
We do find this behavior concerning as well, but don’t currently have confirmation on how/when we might tackle it.. If you want to rank up Waspinator for this, that's up to you, but keep in mind we might make changes to the mode or the Bot in the future.
We really appreciate the concern that you guys have raised over this, and have received a lot of messages from many of you in regards to this. We're sorry we can't be more specific at this time.
@Kabam Miike
Keep in mind before changing sig, this only affects AM. So, you're changing a sig that's used in other modes as well based on one mode. Seems that mode, as outdated as it's become, is just screaming for attention.. not the bot.
I want at least 10-30min. energy timers for the AM
And to be able to take 4 or 5 bots to the AM would be awesome
(Much more T2 Alpha) and T3 Alpha should also be addressed to rewards in AM
This would help everyone that plays the game
Because of the Alliance Mission I’ve heard of players and I’ve seen players quit because of the alliance mission we have today
We need more of a life the alliance mission takes up sooooo much time 😩
@Ænigma what is your ign? I’m curious what makes you the judge of who should be top 3 or not. Do you even know us? Do we know you? Maybe you can try playing with us to get to know us better.
No thanks! From what I hear you guys are a joke I would never want to play with you. Just get off your high horse.
Besides, wasp isn’t the only bot that you can use. If you want to nerf, you’ll need to nerf wheeljack-nano repair, MV-heal with bleed, Megatronus, demo Megatron, etc. So not too sure where Kabam should or can draw the line.
Can't believe what I read,
NERF MV1 Willpower, seriously? How the hell this great thought came to you?
NanoJack is a notable point.
And You one shot Megatronus just like MV1 through his Sign, when they are above 10/20%.
Demotron? What is in him to NERF?
Comments
Besides, wasp isn’t the only bot that you can use. If you want to nerf, you’ll need to nerf wheeljack-nano repair, MV-heal with bleed, Megatronus, demo Megatron, etc. So not too sure where Kabam should or can draw the line.
Well, wasp is open for everyone to choose to use or not to use. Just because you choose not to use it, means everyone else cannot use it? You got upset when Kabam said nerfing your base is “collusion” and players accused Kabam of trying to control what players put on their bases. So why are you now trying to control how other players play? It’s not like it’s only limited to selected players. It’s open to everyone to do so. Go ahead and use it then. There’s no unfair advantage because everyone can take advantage of this.
That's correct, everyone can use it. Which is why Kabam will change it because it will mean the end of a revenue stream for them if nobody needs to spend on repairs/revives.
And your other examples, as Jay accurately pointed out, are an apples and oranges comparison. Dark burn or any other kind of damage-over-time effect can kill Wheeljack (I should know, Galvatron just nearly one-shotted my Wheeljack with a heavy attack in AM; it burned through almost all 3 of his shields). Wheeljack doesn't come back to life after that. Same with MV1. His signature can be outright bypassed by several bot abilities where he can be KO'd and not come back. Demotron, same thing. Waspinator is the only bot that truly comes back to life and gives the player a chance to pause the game, time the fight out, and then do it all over again.
All of this is just semantics at this point anyway. What Kabam worries about is making money to keep the game profitable and going and a bot that can infinitely come back to life every fight won't make them money. If they can nerf Ratchet, they can certainly change Waspinator's sig or just make timeouts be a KO.
That's the important thing to take away from all of this; this is Kabam's game and they can make whatever changes they want. Guess time will tell though.
1) make timeout a KO.. SUCKS, but it seems it is necessary
2) OR.... increase battle timer to 15 minutes. Ain't nobody got time fo' dat.
3) make AM energy a community resource. 1 energy refilled every 10 minutes in each BG (equals same 6x1 we get now), anyone can use it.
4) Increase AM rewards, particularly for lower ranking alliances.
5) profit
@Faithz17 barely anyone actually wants to use wasp so GTFO with that crap. Stop beating around the bush just because you want to stay in top 3. You very well know you don't belong there.
If okay then R4 5* Wasp coming soon
Miike likes to leave us all in suspension for a little while before creeping out to make an appearance. I'm sure when the time comes, and everyone fires all their bullets, Miike will show up and give us his statement.
Perhaps we get the "This thread has become non-constructive and personal, for that reason I will be shutting this thread down."
All other Bots Die and not Revive! So stop your non sense about Waspinator Sig and abilities. Try and kill bots like most of us Do!
Peace out! @miike Kabam the floor is yours!
That would be the same as them saying “we’re ok with you all exploiting waspinator’s signature ability in am”, right?
He may not be saying it violates TOS to abuse the sig, but it is definitely an "unintended exploit" or "circumvention of controls" or similar.
This is using intended functionality in an unintended way that can be exploited, and it is something that we want to address. What that means, we don't know right now. There have been a lot of great suggestions in here regarding timers, timeout penalties, or alterations to Waspinator's signature ability/how often it works, and we have been discussing these ideas.
We do find this behavior concerning as well, but don’t currently have confirmation on how/when we might tackle it.. If you want to rank up Waspinator for this, that's up to you, but keep in mind we might make changes to the mode or the Bot in the future.
We really appreciate the concern that you guys have raised over this, and have received a lot of messages from many of you in regards to this. We're sorry we can't be more specific at this time.
Thanks for showing up and shedding some light on this topic. We appreciate it.
But it seems to me that you are telling us that if we want to exploit this, we are allowed to do so. But at some point in the future, there might be changes that will adjust this matter so it will no longer be an exploit and that we shouldn't be mad about ranking wasp if we do so.
If this is ok I wonder why the so called collusion with some folks lowering there base difficulties to make it easier to raid we a problem? (Still not sure how they did it with revenge being broke and opponents random)
How could you guys not know what that means when you just said you know what it means? lol
What some people are going to interpret this confusing statement as is instead of "we don't know what this means" is that they're going to read it as "we're too busy with other things, too (fill-in-the-blank) to care about changing this even though we know it's messing everything up.
You know what you guys sound like? You guys sound tired. Like that tired, grumpy old man who just can't be bothered to do anything about anything because life has beat them down and they just don't care anymore. That's what that statement sounds like.
Where did that young, spry, decisive development team we all knew and loved go? The one that nerfed Ratchet's overpowered heal with a surprisingly balanced interpretation of him? The team that used to do fun interviews with the guys who worked on the bots themselves on the Game Updates page, before it was converted into a mausoleum?
You guys just sound resigned, which doesn't sound good to us. Is there something you want to share with the rest of us?
As you mentioned, people here have listed some great solutions. How about acting on one of them? Waspinator is a bot who is low on the popularity scale with the majority of players but who also has an incredibly exploitable signature ability. How do you want to fix it?
Pick one of these:
1. Change the signature ability. Not the easiest course by any means, but it would also mean balancing a bot that has desperately needed some buffs in certain areas. This would be the chance to do that and chalk up a win with the community who has been asking for this for over a year now. Not my first choice, as I want something more immediate, but it would also be nice to have him crossed off my list of bots who need re-balancing.
2. A. Change the AM timer so that we have more time on the timer and/or a time out equals a KO. Changing the timer to 60 minutes would be the easiest, fastest fix for this, as he still gets to use his signature ability.
B. Changing it to 8 minutes + time out equals KO would probably be the next best solution, but a little more work and probably not as popular, as people seem to not have positive reactions to that phrase, KO.
3. Temporarily lock Waspinator out of AM until you can decide between options 1 and 2A or 2B.
Pick one of these ASAP and please get back to us to let us know what choice you've made. Even if you went with solution 2A and said, "this is temporary until we can come up with something else" I think everyone would be OK with that. Just please, no more with the "we'll get back to you in the near future" stuff. We've heard tons of that rhetoric already with regards to the new content threads and it doesn't fly very well here these days.
as in, they don't know how they will address this exploit as of right now
I understand it's a loophole anyone can take advantage of but why make AMs into something like that? It's suppose to be one of bigger challenge modes of this game. An actual test of skill and not a grind fest waiting for TOs. Rewards were already dated compare to other game modes but this makes it even less of a reason to play at high levels.
Since you've already stated this is an exploit, Kabam could make an official announcement to the player base that this strategy is not allowed. Any player caught using is gets the 7 day ban, second offense gets a permanent ban. This is probably not in the best interest of Kabam so please decide with your team what course of action you would like to take to protect the players and Kabam's revenue side. Hurry though, this is not one of those issues that should take months to resolve.
@Kabam Miike
Keep in mind before changing sig, this only affects AM. So, you're changing a sig that's used in other modes as well based on one mode. Seems that mode, as outdated as it's become, is just screaming for attention.. not the bot.
And to be able to take 4 or 5 bots to the AM would be awesome
(Much more T2 Alpha) and T3 Alpha should also be addressed to rewards in AM
This would help everyone that plays the game
Because of the Alliance Mission I’ve heard of players and I’ve seen players quit because of the alliance mission we have today
We need more of a life the alliance mission takes up sooooo much time 😩
No thanks! From what I hear you guys are a joke I would never want to play with you. Just get off your high horse.
Can't believe what I read,
NERF MV1 Willpower, seriously? How the hell this great thought came to you?
NanoJack is a notable point.
And You one shot Megatronus just like MV1 through his Sign, when they are above 10/20%.
Demotron? What is in him to NERF?